Indy Johar: “The Foundational Challenge: Stewardship, Responsibility, and Designing a New System”




Episode 147
October 23rd, 2024

(Conversation recorded on October 3rd, 2024)  

Show Summary

While humans, like all animals, are subject to certain fundamental realities, we also possess the unique ability to shape the world around us through physical infrastructure, laws and institutions, and our economic and social systems. And yet, it’s important to remember that, as today’s guest would say, what we design designs us back. In short, the systems and structures we build influence our cultures, values, and identities.

Today, Nate is joined by architect and professor of planetary civics, Indy Johar, to explore the relationship between system design and human behavior - and what might be possible for transformational change. Along the way, they discuss the impact of sunk costs on our ability to change, the importance of new language to describe and respond to our human predicament, and envision future governance and economies that could enable the full spectrum of what it means to be human. 

What sorts of unconventional ideas, like self-owning land and technology, could lead to economies that are capable of sustaining humans as well as foster a healthy planet? How do our current societies prevent us from embodying and living into our greatest gifts as human beings? Is it possible to intentionally redesign our systems at the physical, structural, and psychological levels in service of all the entangled life inhabiting the Earth?

About Indy Johar

Indy Johar is co-founder of Dark Matter Labs, as well as the RIBA award winning architecture and urban practice Architecture00. He is also a founding director of Open Systems Lab, seeded WikiHouse (open source housing), and Open Desk (open source furniture company).

Indy is also a non-executive international Director of the BloxHub, which is the Nordic Hub for sustainable urbanization. He has taught & lectured at various institutions from the University of Bath, TU-Berlin; University College London, Princeton, Harvard, MIT and New School. He is currently a professor at RMIT University.

Show Notes & Links to Learn More

PDF Transcript

00:00 - Indy Johar info, Dark Matter Labs, Project 00 + Architecture 00, Open Systems Lab, Blox Hub

02:26 - Emerge 

03:45 - WikiHouse + Opendesk, Impact Hubs

05:32 - Theory of property + Property Law

07:35 - The Code of Capital, Katharine Pistor

08:22 - Churchill on our buildings shaping us 

09:12 - Impact of studying economics on behavior, Homo Economicus

10:25 - Classification theory

10:48 - Africa is more genetically diverse than anywhere else

11:26 - The Agricultural Revolution, Hernán Cortés, Aztec Civilization

15:50 - James Lovelock, Novacene

17:16 - Marvin Harris’ cultural materialism

19:13 - Path dependence

20:55 - Indigenous worldviews opening up new possibilities in Canada

21:27 - Locations of tipping elements

23:30 - Only 176,000 homes per year can be built within Europe’s carbon budget, projected construction is over 1.5 million homes

24:20 - Extreme rain in North Carolina

24:40 - Insurance companies and Hurricane Helene

25:40 - Extreme weather, insurance and housing

28:19 - Ed Conway + TGS Episode

28:30 - Daniel Schmachtenberger + Bend Not Break series, TGS Episode on Naive Progress

32:32 - Economic Superorganism

34:09 - Rivers given legal agency in New Zealand 

37:09 - Life-Enobling Economics

41:20 - Research on quantum computation in the human brain

41:55 - Fermi paradox

46:05 - Intentional community + examples

47:35 - Multi capital value, Situational Intelligence

49:05 - Conditions enabling the Industrial Revolution in the UK

49:52 - TGS Episode on Artificial Intelligence

51:00 - The idea of the corporation + the role of the corporation in society

1:00:20 - Jayne Engle, Mi’kmaw Native Friendship Center

1:00:55 - Cities committing to tree canopy strategies, the survival of community-planted trees

1:04:30 - 19 terawatt economy

1:06:05 - Energy efficiency of plant based diets

1:06:44 - Soil health and nutrient density from regenerative agriculture

1:07:38 - Autonomous three wheelers

1:08:20 - Vacant real estate in Europe

1:09:10 - Afforestation and carbon sequestration + afforestation and soil properties

1:09:55 - Material passports

1:14:15 - Othering

1:15:23 - The free rider problem

1:22:25 - Biological weapons, existential risk

1:28:36 - Noun-based vs verb-based languages

1:30:36 - Reimagining labor

1:35:29 - Dark Matter Labs publications

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Bill Plotkin: “Ecological Awakening: A Path Toward Holistic Adulthood”